Ok when I started playing this mod, I was always all: "oh no, stay away from the zombies, if they bite you, you are d00000med!".
Seeing as I was wrong, my attitude quickly changed, and eventually it became like this: "fuck zombies, let them bite all they want, you'll go zombie, kill a few marines, get good exp and become human again".

See, this kind of ruins gameplay. The whole meaning of zombie games it that you don't want to become a zombie. So, a little suggestion for evening out gameplay:

Ok, let's say you become a zombie, how are you gonne become a player again? Kill marines? No! To become a player again you have to kill ANOTHER player. Immeadetly after you kill this player, you will spawn as a human, however, this player will spawn as a zombie. This way, there will always be a constant (and growing) number of zombies on the server.

Say you start off with 12 marines, no zombies. One of the marines get bitten by a zombie, all the other players will constantly (in fear of becoming a zombie themselves) move away from the infected player and prepare to kill him. Now you have 1 zombie, and 11 marines. The poor zombie CAN become a marine again, if he kills one of his teammates. Which, most likely, he will try to do. At killing one of his teammates, the team mate will spawn as a zombie with the other zombies, while the zombie who killed him, will spawn as a marine. If people are carefull enough, they'll win. But without teamwork and the like, marines will never win the game and zombies will prevail!

Personally I like the idea.

Mmh... i think that would lead to a direction that won't fit to this mod. It would be "zombie panic" with additional ai zombies... this game should be a coop-arcade-zombieshooter and becoming one of the zombies shouldn't be that frustrating. Personally i don't like the idea of becoming a player controlled zombie (but the rest of the team ^^), because it doesn't fit to the overall coop gameplay... but that's just my personal opinion. ^^

The idea of becoming a zombie is just to punish you in a funny way. In the next version you'll be able to play as a zombie, too... but we'll focus elements on coop and mission objectives. If you're a zombie you'll restart after 30 seconds as a human / you'll restart if you kill two marines or one human player. Also there won't be a special team for zombies; the player will be just red in the scoretable. If you manage to escape you're able to return as a zombie to make it harder for other people to escape, but if you got bitten within the game you'll lose 15 scorepoints and turn into a zombie for this short time.
We know that some people like to play zombies, but that's not the whole attitude of this mod (and often ppl got frustrated). They'll be able to play as a zombie; and if they could escape they even have the chance to make it harder for the rest of the team...

beeing a zombie is just for fun, it doesnt have any real meaning. your main concirn is NOT becomming a zombie.

I see what people are saying "wow so what if your a zombie you'll just go kill some marines and be a human again, what exactly are we lossing?"

but the obvious response to this is your losing time, it's a time based game and if you spend most of your time as a zomie you won't be able to do the missions.

simple as

Exactly! Should be included into the FAQ.

hehe

Only to become a human if u kill another player is not good....you couldn't become a human again in offline mode....and sometimes I want to play offline!

@Spassti: Hast da wohl was nicht verstanden. Nach 30 Sekunden wirst du nun immer als Mensch respawnen. Beschleunigen kannst du das nach wie vor indem du zwei Marines oder eben einen Spieler tötest. ^^

The idea of the mod *hope you are listening Mole, or im going to beat you wit a stick!* is to work as a team,and try to complete yur objectives and get the hell outta there. For example if it was me and four buddies and zombie sourrounded us from one side im not going to say "don't worry guys i will let them turn me into one of them" NO! that is not the point of the mod, but i am going to do is "you guys go on with out me i will hold them off! GO!" That is teamwork their and hopefully i will have a flamethrower in hand and backing up burning them all up.

now this aint just pointed at you zuw so don't think I'm attacking u or picking on you in any way, but why are ppl always saying "I never knew this was a co-op game" ????? I mean have u never actually played the game? and if you have then that obviously means that you've never EVER played any other online game in your life. you see I only found out about this mod on the day it was released, but right away I could tell it was a co-op without even having to read anything about the game, I mean I swear its really that obvious, either that or I'm actually a genius and just haven't noticed it.


again Zuw I aint having a go at you or anything dont take any of what I have said personally I'm just making a point

I was always the supporter of a Zombie Panic-alike game mode as cvar so server administrators can decide what kind of game mode should run.

Currently only Slaywatch fits into the coop mode because its a limited area and theres a chance of coop because all players and the mission target is within range. In Heavens Gate you have nearly no chances for coop team play because it has no guide for the players. Even if you try to fulfil the mission goals mostly it end in splitting off and single wandering around killing zombies.

I must admit that gunslinger with his beta test critics was in most aspects right. Theres no guide for the player and to complex mission goals.

Sorry to say but MadMaxx as much as I love your map it doesnt fit into to coop play style. If you check out the maps of the Sven Coop you can see the difference. Sven Coop maps guide the player better. Even as there are no real mission objectives but the players also have to do certain action to get through the level (pressing button, killing a boss, etc.) and their mission goals are weaved into the map and they feel more natural than getting the case or killing x zombies.

Im confident that you have to simplify the mission objections to make it more fun to play as coop like the overall goal is to reach (and hold) a special zone (escape zone) and you have to fulfil some natural task on the way to the mission zone like press a switch in an area with many zombies (that opens a door for example) and afterwards kill a boss (Fred) so a gate opens.

And I highly suggest a zombie panic alike mode defined by a cvar. That way you can satisfy the more competitive gamers (like me) and also the casual gamers

It seems to me the dev team dont like the idea if a competitive Brainbread but competition keeps the player motivated. And there are also positives in such maps are easier to create for a competitive mode.

Dont hesitate to borrow an idea if its a good idea

And if you dont implement it I have to grab the metamod sdk and do it myself: P (still need to get metamod running on BB)

Ok and if you ask how I came to that conclusion. Im have an own dedicated BB server (see signature) and as my Natural-Selection server is down because my hoster is moving I invited my Natural-Selection regulars to play a BB. Most of them are casual gamer but well aware of team work, cooperation and communication (all using voice) but we got no teamwork running because everybody running their own way sooner or later even as we tried to tie together. This was a group of player knowing each other and knows how to work together as a good team.

I would like to hear how the dev team thinks about that competitive switch and if theres a chance if it will get included.

I think the new linear maps will fit the coop theme better, although linear and limited maps will not feel "more natural", they just guide the player easier. On the other hand a lot of the fun elements cannot be found in linear maps: after you know heavens gate you have to think of which way to take to get as fast or as save as possible to a certain point in the map.
In lanpartys where you have direct communications linear maps will not be as multifaceted as for example Heaven's Gate, so I would definately not say in general, that Heaven's Gate does not fit the coop theme. It's just depending on the circumstances . All the criticism Gunslinger gave was a) already mentioned by the betasters and B) only one side of the cookie (as usual). Many persons playing BB did disagree with those arguments and it's hard for us to find our who's "right".
By changing the gameplay of f.e. Heaven's gate we would destroy many innovative aspects of BB and limit the possibilites. I totaly agree with you if it comes to implement both ways of coop possibilities. linear maps are in work and I think they might work better online.
To solve the problem of different tastes we try to implement different styles and gameplaymodes in the future, so there's something for everybody. The teamdeathmatch will not have priority atm, since there are many mods offering exactly this one. But we do have a idea of how to make playerzombies a match for players in an original way, and this is the first step into a possible teamdeathmatch cvar.